User talk:Tom Morris/Archive 37

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Views/Day	Quality	Title	Content	Headings	Images	Links	Sources	Tagged with…
4,722		Philosophy (talk)						Add sources
18		Livestock (Brand X album) (talk)						Add sources
2		Albert Bettannier (talk)						Add sources
5		American Performance Technologies (talk)						Add sources
2,530		Metaphysics (talk)						Add sources
60		Foreign relations of Serbia (talk)						Add sources
4		James R. Kass (talk)						Cleanup
117		Random act of kindness (talk)						Cleanup
421		Logical positivism (talk)						Cleanup
2,666		Dutch language (talk)						Expand
5		Europe's Inner Demons (talk)						Expand
193		Emirates Air Line (gondola lift) (talk)						Expand
1,314		Waiting for Godot (talk)						Unencyclopaedic
141		Manosphere (talk)						Unencyclopaedic
38		Clan (video gaming) (talk)						Unencyclopaedic
25		Soft despotism (talk)						Merge
104		Experimenter's bias (talk)						Merge
80		Justified true belief (talk)						Merge
606		Racism in the United States (talk)						Wikify
504		Relativism (talk)						Wikify
180		Flamenco guitar (talk)						Wikify
3		Miscarriages of Justice: University of Limerick (talk)						Orphan
4		Krazy Kong (talk)						Orphan
9		Identitäre Bewegung Österreichs (talk)						Orphan
10		Flexpower (talk)						Stub
39		Special Source Operations (talk)						Stub
4		Swansea Heads, New South Wales (talk)						Stub
10		Warrant for Genocide (talk)						Stub
12		Hartry Field (talk)						Stub
3		Liberalism in Nicaragua (talk)						Stub

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An editor has asked for a deletion review of Enterprise Architect (Software). Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Leggattst (talk) 07:19, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

I do apologise for not getting back to you, Leggattst. I was going to userfy the page yesterday but didn't get around to it. I'll close the DRV as well. —Tom Morris (talk) 08:23, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Tom, Thank you. Much appreciated. I will run over your earlier points and make some updates. Leggattst (talk) 00:42, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

07:07, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Hello I am Jon. I am glad that the page was locked for good reason, I just got off work and anticipated that there will be an editing war here on the page, and I was right. This edit war was started by Pvpoodle, Shulinjiang and some other unregistered users. At first, Pvpoodle wanted to push through his own personal propaganda and other users Shulinjiang I assume, pushed back. I have been reading both of their comments for some time and they are very similar personality wise but completely different politically and standing wise! To reach a general consensus on this issue, I suggest that both pro-Kamov and Pro-CAIC sources to be kept with one countering each other!

To point out the mistakes of Pvpoodle's sources. 1. His source cited that: " In 1995, Kamov developed a preliminary design in the 6t weight class under a contract with the Chinese government, says Sergey Mikheev, Kamov's chief design engineer, speaking at the Heli-Expo trade show in Las Vegas, Nevada." Since it is preliminary, this means the remaining and bulk of the WZ-10's deigns were done by the Chinese especially CAIC under Wu Xing Ming. 2. "Due to understandable reasons, this information was kept secret, he says." His source basically says that WZ-10's Preliminary design was done by Kamov under secret and now just three month after WZ-10 was officially revealed, all of a sudden Kamov's chief designer came out and "declassify" their involvement! 3. Mikheev says. "They gave us the desired weight, we discussed preliminary performance parameters, then we signed a contract and we fulfilled the contract, he says". Then later: "Mikheev would not comment on the WZ-10's performance." His sources contradict each other. If Kamov's deigner Mikheev has the audacity to say that Kamov's did WZ-10's initial design with all the preliminary performance parameters, then why he could not tell WZ-10's performance? 4. All four of his sources were written from March,7,2013 to March,15,2013. Just 8 days apart and just three month after the Chinese revealed the WZ-10, they all contain the same contents quoting form Kamov's designer Mikheev. 5. Pvpoodle deliberately made a mistake on the countering source provided by other users. The title "俄罗斯之声：武直-10全靠中国人自己完成," in Chinese translates that "Voice of Russia: WZ-10 is completely done by the Chinese themselves." Pvpoodle's translation is: " Voice of Russia: WZ -10 thanks to the Chinese people themselves to complete." It seems that he had used google translate which incorrectly translated the sentence. 俄罗斯之声=Voice of Russia, 全靠中国人自己完成=Completely done by Chinese themselves. This article was written on 03/13/2013, the exact same time period when those four western sources had been published. Its purpose was to quote their contents and debunk them. 6. As everyone can see on the WZ-10 page, it was well written and I have spend hours writing it. Each section from weapon systems, engines, rotor blades, glass cockpit, avionics, radars and flight testing were all designed and done by the Chinese themselves. All the components of WZ-10 were also supplied by Chinese companies, although WZ-10 did use PW engine as its initial engines for flight testing, but the finial production ones were using WoZ-9, a Chinese engine. Yet Pvpoodle give all the design credit to Kamov, which according to his own source stated that Kamov was only involved in its preliminary design.

I suggest that a general consensus to be made from all the editors here on this page and end this edit war, that keep all sourced contents.

1. Change the designer of WZ-10 to: Preliminary design done by Kamov, Prototype and Critical Components designs done by CAIC under Wu XingMing.

2. Remove this section from the front page"It was designed by Kamov design bureau of Russia under a contract by the Chinese government.[1][2][3][4] It was further developed and flight tested by the 602nd Research Institute under Wu Ximing (吴希明) and is being built by Changhe Aircraft Industries Corporation (CAIC). [1][2][3][4]" under the design content.

Therefor, the front page would look like this: The Z-10 (Chinese: 直-10 for 直升机) is an attack helicopter developed by the People's Republic of China. It is designed primarily for anti-tank missions but has secondary air-to-air capability as well.

Nicknames of characters in the Chinese classic novel Water Margin was used to name Z-10 and its smaller comrade Harbin Z-19: Z-10 is named as Fierce Thunderbolt (Pi Li Huo, 霹靂火), the nickname of Qin Ming, while Z-19 is named as Black Whirlwind (Hei Xuan Feng, 黑旋風), the nickname of Li Kui.[7][8]

3. Under the design content section it would look like this:

The Kamov design bureau was contracted to perform the preliminary design work under a secret contract. Kamov designed , tested and verified the helicopter design, after which it was provided to the Chinese team.[1][2][3][4] The full prototype design and critical components designs were all done by Chinese themselves.

Wu Ximing (吴希明) of the 602nd Research Institute, one of the Chinese top scientists involved in the 863 Program was publicly credited with being the chief designer of the Z-10, in an attempt to preserve the secrecy of the Kamov contract. Wu had earlier participated in the designs of the armed version of transport helicopters Z-8A and WZ-9. In order to complete the necessary development, the 602nd Research Institute and CAIC had jointly built a new engineering design center, industrial simulator, aircraft engine ground test center, fatigue laboratory, and rotary test platform (nicknamed as Iron Bird Platform, 铁鸟台). In the end of 2001, the final test was completed on the full-scale rotary test platform, paving the way for test flights.

Composite material is widely used in the Z-10 but China faced difficulties in this field, particularly in the area of survivability during crashes. Huge efforts were spent to domestically develop composite materials able to provide comparable levels of survivability to Western counterparts. This achievement earned a 2nd place in the Commission for Science, Technology and Industry for National Defense (COSTIND) progress reward.

64.134.169.84 (talk) 22:48, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

just to bring to your attention that this is the same guy Shulinjiang who was blocked for sock puppeting. Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Shulinjiang is still open. he has got it into his head that i am responsible for adding "false evil western claims" to the article and continues to go through great lengths to try and prove me wrong. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pvpoodle (talk • contribs) 06:07, 8 July 2014‎

The whole reason the page is locked is so you can argue about it on the talk page. I won't read any of this because I don't know or care about the topic in question and my talk page is not the place to discuss it. Go to the talk page and comment there. —Tom Morris (talk) 05:42, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Of course that never happens to me. Cheers.Peter Rehse (talk) 18:29, 9 July 2014 (UTC)

07:49, 14 July 2014 (UTC)

14:07, 15 July 2014 (UTC)