Talk:Coup d'état
Latest comment: 5 months ago by Chipmunkdavis in topic 2021 Bouvet Island coup
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Current definition is flawed
editThere are a number of academic datasets and publications that define coup d'état. None of them define it as being merely "a seizure and removal of a government and its powers", which is so vague and general that it's basically any transfer of government. This edit should be reverted[1]. What most common academic definitions of coup have in common is that it's an "an illegal and overt attempt by the military or other government elites to unseat the incumbent leader." Thenightaway (talk) 13:39, 15 July 2023 (UTC)
- This is how the main coup datasets define a coup:
- # Powell and Thyne: "To summarize, our definition of a coup attempt includes illegal and overt attempts by the military or other elites within the state apparatus to unseat the sitting executive."[2]
- # Chin, Carter and Wright: "A coup d ́etat occurs whenever the incumbent ruling regime or regime leader is ousted from power (or a presumptive regime leader is prevented from taking power) as a result of concrete, observable, and unconstitutional actions by one or more civilian members of the incumbent ruling regime and/or one or more members of the military or security apparatus."[3]
- Why exactly does the lead uses a vastly different definition, which isn't even supported by all the sources in the lead or the article? As far as I can tell, the only citation that supports the flawed definition in the current lead is a generalist dictionary authored by someone who does not study coups (Robertson, David (2004). The Routledge Dictionary of Politics. Routledge). Thenightaway (talk) 18:07, 21 July 2023 (UTC)
- It's because during extensive discussions last year on the List of Coups article Talk, editors were simultaneously changing the definitions in this article (as well as the WP:MOS). The purpose was entirely, by the stated purpose of editors, to ensure that January 6 would be listed as a coup, despite it being included in no academic dataset. SamuelRiv (talk) 00:43, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
- Agreed. After purchasing several first edition books on Napoleon and reaching out to the Morning Chronicle for assistance in locating the specific article referencing January 7th as the “day after” the attempted unseating of Napoleon, I did not find anything in the year cited. I also believe the new and expanded definition was concocted to support a conspiratorial narrative unsupported by historical facts. 2600:8805:4605:1400:A9C8:52C3:10CA:90F4 (talk) 12:52, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
- It's because during extensive discussions last year on the List of Coups article Talk, editors were simultaneously changing the definitions in this article (as well as the WP:MOS). The purpose was entirely, by the stated purpose of editors, to ensure that January 6 would be listed as a coup, despite it being included in no academic dataset. SamuelRiv (talk) 00:43, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
2021 Bouvet Island coup
editI have not heard about it before and google knows nothing about it... Is it just a joke, a political in-joke perhaps? 80.208.64.101 (talk) 19:44, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
- Just vandalism. CMD (talk) 01:21, 24 May 2024 (UTC)