User talk:Ndeavour

Hello, I'm Qwerfjkl (bot). I have automatically detected that this edit performed by you, on the page Dusty Baker, may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:

• A "missing title" error. References show this error when they do not have a title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. (Fix | Ask for help)

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, Qwerfjkl (bot) (talk) 18:54, 17 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Ndeavour. We welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a conflict of interest may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the conflict of interest guideline and FAQ for article subjects for more information. We ask that you:

• avoid editing or creating articles about yourself, your family, friends, colleagues, company, organization, clients, or competitors;
• propose changes on the talk pages of affected articles (you can use the {{edit COI}} template);
• disclose your conflict of interest when discussing affected articles (see Wikipedia:Conflict of interest § How to disclose a COI);
• avoid linking to your organization's website in other articles (see Wikipedia:Spam § External link spamming);
• do your best to comply with Wikipedia's content policies.

In addition, you are required by the Wikimedia Foundation's terms of use to disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution which forms all or part of work for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation. See Wikipedia:Paid-contribution disclosure.

Also, editing for the purpose of advertising, publicising, or promoting anyone or anything is not permitted. Thank you. Polygnotus (talk) 21:24, 6 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Very informative, thank you. Since I have not considered editing the Landmark Worldwide page, but have simply questioned what I consider to be sloppy work that shows a point of view (versus the neutrality purported to be the goal of Wikipedia), I'm not sure any of that applies, but should I venture into actively editing the article, I will bear those guidelines in mind and adhere to them.

It seems to me that the sources cited are being misquoted and misused, and therefore, the sections lack the kind of rigorous research you referred to in your response on the talk page. That weakens the integrity of Wikipedia, and I would argue that neither of us wishes to see that happen. I want to see this as a foundational aspect for my grandchildren to use if they happen to get curious about the world/culture/society they have inherited. That's not advocating for Landmark - it's advocating for responsible journalism. Ndeavour (talk) 18:25, 8 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Ndeavour: Have you ever done a Landmark course? What is your relationship with Landmark, Erhard and related entities? I can assure you people have spent a LOT of time on that article. Polygnotus (talk) 18:28, 8 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

To be clear, I have done Landmark programs. I am not about to edit the article, nor am I questioning whether or not some people have expressed concerns about the company and wondered if it could be a cult. It's simply that the vast majority of them, including the sources that are cited, conclude that it isn't. Time spent does not always equate with time well spent, especially if accuracy is compromised.

I said in my initial post that, given the strong point of view you seem to have, that the section in some form should be retained - just move it to a different location, and correct the misrepresentations. Again, that seems a feat of editing beyond my talents so I am not about to attempt it; and therefore will not edit the article.

Now, it's my turn to ask - what has led to your position? If such a question is outside of the policies here, then I apologize in advance. Ndeavour (talk) 17:32, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You answered one question, which I already knew the answer to, but you have not answered the other question: What is your relationship with Landmark, Erhard and related entities? Polygnotus (talk) 18:27, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As soon as you clarify your position, I'll be happy to answer. Ndeavour (talk) 16:40, 15 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

According to you we were taking turns. So when you've finished your turn it will be mine. I wouldn't wanna be impolite and speak before it is my turn to do so. Polygnotus (talk) 16:51, 15 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What a clever reply! As I said, I've done Landmark's programs. I will add that I have participated for quite some time, gotten great value and have at times stopped participating. What is your relationship with Landmark? What has lead to your position? Ndeavour (talk) 16:08, 18 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. So your relationship with them is that you worked as a volunteer (e.g. seminar leader)? Or did you receive money from them? Polygnotus (talk) 17:34, 18 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What has led to your position? I ask again, having answered your question as requested. Ndeavour (talk) 14:22, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If you are referring to my edit dated 18:28, 8 March 2024 (UTC) above, you'll find that I asked not one but two questions. You answered one. Polygnotus (talk) 14:25, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since you haven't answered my question - I have asked it more than once - I consider that my answer is sufficient for now. Once again I will ask you: what has lead to your position? Ndeavour (talk) 14:33, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What is your favourite animal? And what is your favourite dinosaur? Polygnotus (talk) 14:38, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think the Hemicentetes semispinosus is pretty cool but as a pet I prefer cats. My favourite dinosaur is the ankylosaurus. Polygnotus (talk) 14:53, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, I get it. You aren't interested in any real dialogue and have resorted to nonsense in place of replies. I thought about finding out who at Wiki to speak to and then decided to stop wasting my time. Enjoy your cats and your opinions. Ndeavour (talk) 20:56, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The reaction I had to your two most recent comments has kept me from engaging with Wikipedia for two weeks now. I repeatedly asked about the background for your point of view and you rudely blew me off with nonsensical replies rather than answering. I don't usually get upset, but I did.

If that wasn't your intent, then please be aware that such behavior on the part of someone with extensive Wikipedia history has left this potential contributor shocked, disappointed and reluctant to continue here. And if that WAS your intent, then I need to find out who to speak with and register a complaint, since how that represents Wikipedia is in direct opposition to what I understand that it stands for.

Like it or not, own it or not, your years of experience has you representing the entire community. I think I need to let others with more experience and background be the judge. Ndeavour (talk) 15:54, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Ndeavour! I noticed your contributions and wanted to welcome you to the Wikipedia community. I hope you like it here and decide to stay.

As you get started, you may find this short tutorial helpful:

Learn more about editing

Alternatively, the contributing to Wikipedia page covers the same topics.

If you have any questions, we have a friendly space where experienced editors can help you here:

Get help at the Teahouse

If you are not sure where to help out, you can find a task here:

Volunteer at the Task Center

Happy editing! DaveApter (talk) 15:40, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@DaveApter - thank you very much! I've not read through everything down this pathway, but having a distinct starting point makes working in this medium much easer to contemplate. Ndeavour (talk) 16:54, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Ndeavour, If you haven't already read them, you might find the summary of Wikipedia's policies and guidelines helpful.

Wikipedia requires all users to be civil, to assume good faith, and to refrain from casting aspersions, so you might find it useful to follow the links to the pages explaining those policies.

In relation to the constructive comments you made on the Landmark Worldwide talk page, you might find the guidelines on the WP:OPINION page useful.

Finally, if you want to get background on the editing history of editors who are interacting with you, this is a really useful tool: https://xtools.wmcloud.org/ec/en.wikipedia.org/ DaveApter (talk) 16:01, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Again, thank you. Ndeavour (talk) 17:12, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]