Talk:SS Edmund Fitzgerald
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Lakes Huron and Erie "Missing" (not colored in blue) in interactive map of wreck location
editThe interactive map of the wreck location is quite confusing because Lakes Huron and Erie are not colored blue, they look like land. Since the ship was bound for the Detroit area, this is especially confusing because it looks like the ship would have had to go hundreds of miles over land to get to Detroit. Gruhl~enwiki (talk) 13:30, 10 November 2022 (UTC)
- You're right, that is a terrible map. North8000 (talk) 14:41, 10 November 2022 (UTC)
- It's a long-standing issue with how Wikipedia processes the OpenStreetMap tiles. At certain zoom levels, the tiles for Lake Huron disappear, only to reappear at other zoom levels. They're working on a solution. Imzadi 1979 → 18:49, 10 November 2022 (UTC)
Clarification, references and ambiguity
editThis article was written without clear clarification, ex. " a distance it could have traveled in an hour"; what does that even mean? The entire lake or the 17 miles? Also almost no references or proper geographic references in some places. Jcqpoier (talk) 14:04, 11 November 2022 (UTC)
- ???On the first part of your post, what you quoted is not even in the article, and the most similar quote is well explained. The second part is too vague to respond to, but noting that the article referencing did pass the very tough review in that area during FA review. North8000 (talk) 16:23, 11 November 2022 (UTC)
Did Sault Tribe back an expedition?
editThe sentence "The Sault Tribe of Chippewa Indians backed the expedition by co-signing a loan in the amount of $250,000" uses this as a source. I looked at the source. It does not mention the loan. I may delete that sentence if no one can find a source for it. --David Tornheim (talk) 22:46, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
- I think it's good to delete it. North8000 (talk) 02:32, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
- Suggest that instead of "deleting it", you make a revision, identifying the four organizations that sponsored the dive (according to this page. Probably worth verifying the rest of that paragraph, though. Risker (talk) 02:37, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
- Or change it to the information that's on the page that you provided and change the target of the ref to that page. North8000 (talk) 03:36, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
Updated version of last radio transmission
editI wonder about the provenance of the additional portion of the last radio transmission. The 1978 NTSB report states that the last transmission was "We are holding our own." Sources as recent as 2020 do not give any more than that, yet some more recent sources are giving the last transmission as "We are holding our own, going along like an old shoe." Does anyone have any insight as to the change? Imzadi 1979 → 05:17, 16 November 2023 (UTC)
- @Imzadi1979: It looks like the only source of that extra part is an interview with the other captain, speaking from his memory decades later. I have and read all the books on the Fitz and none of them had that in the quote. North8000 (talk) 20:49, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- I don't think there's any recording of it. The investigators probably got it from Cooper. So maybe what we hare is what Cooper said during the investigation at the time conflicting with what Cooper said decades later from memory? North8000 (talk) 20:57, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- In 1993 Cooper himself said just "We are holding our own." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VXY6tuZ5eU I think it needs to be removed. North8000 (talk) 21:05, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- Actually the "old shoe" is even weaker than that. It's what Mark Brush said that Mike Simonson said that Cooper said decades later, and conflicts with what Cooper said in 1993 at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VXY6tuZ5eU and with what Coope apparently said to the investigators at the time. I'm going to take it out. North8000 (talk) 21:10, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
- I just removed this yet again. Meters (talk) 22:24, 15 November 2024 (UTC)
- And I removed the recent addition of this claim from the captain's article, Ernest M. McSorley. Meters (talk) 21:50, 16 November 2024 (UTC)
- I have found a 2015 Michigan Public Radio reference that uses the "going along like an old shoe" version of the quote, so it's at least that old: https://www.michiganpublic.org/arts-culture/2015-11-10/listen-to-radio-transmission-on-the-night-of-the-edmund-fitzgeralds-sinking Not surprisingly, despite the deceptive title of the site, "Listen to radio transmission on the night of the Edmund Fitzgerald's sinking", it is not the actual transmissions of that night. Instead it's a radio show about the last night. The quote is from Thom Holden, the the curator of the Army Corps of Engineers' Lake Superior Maritime Visitor Center. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Meters (talk • contribs) 22:14, 16 November 2024 (UTC)
- I found the actual transcript from the log from the Great Lakes Shipwreck Museum:https://www.wzzm13.com/article/news/history/ss-edmund-fitzgerald-49th-anniversary/69-597bd3cc-367f-4ee1-92de-26a1c4fc8bd9
- I do stand corrected, about Captain McSorley's last words. It seems from reading that Captain Cooper added the "going along like an old shoe." part. Brotherbenz (talk) 22:29, 16 November 2024 (UTC)
- No problem. That version of the quote has been around for several years, and it now shows up in many sources. Meters (talk) 23:15, 16 November 2024 (UTC)
- I have found a 2015 Michigan Public Radio reference that uses the "going along like an old shoe" version of the quote, so it's at least that old: https://www.michiganpublic.org/arts-culture/2015-11-10/listen-to-radio-transmission-on-the-night-of-the-edmund-fitzgeralds-sinking Not surprisingly, despite the deceptive title of the site, "Listen to radio transmission on the night of the Edmund Fitzgerald's sinking", it is not the actual transmissions of that night. Instead it's a radio show about the last night. The quote is from Thom Holden, the the curator of the Army Corps of Engineers' Lake Superior Maritime Visitor Center. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Meters (talk • contribs) 22:14, 16 November 2024 (UTC)
Personal note
edit- personal note by John Eilers - I know a last minute drop out crew member of The Edmund, he was supposed to be an galley mate (an cook) but my grandfather hired this crew member and he became a "Uncle" family friend. If he would have said no to my grandfather the bell would have ring 30 times instead of 29. I'm glad but also sad that it was only my "uncle" that was spared. - end of note by John Eilers - — Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.226.109.10 (talk) 06:16, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
Dates need to be reviewed for accuracy
editSnippet: SS Edmund Fitzgerald was an American Great Lakes freighter that sank in Lake Superior during a storm on November 10, 1975, with the loss of the entire crew of 29 men. When launched on June 7, 1958, she was the largest ship on North America
If it sank on November 10, 1975, shouldn't the date for when she launched be before June 7, 1958? I really don't think it possible to launch after sinking, correct? 97.87.22.82 (talk) 11:48, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
- ?? 1958 IS before 1975. North8000 (talk) 14:45, 13 November 2024 (UTC)